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Argentine tango blog
/ with Interaction Design interludes / by Oleh Kovalchuke |
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Tango teaching and learning
"Freedom to a dancer means discipline. That is what technique is for -- liberation."
Martha GrahamA review clip from the workshop I taught in Cleveland, OH:
A demo dance from the same workshop:
May. 9, 2006 - Instructional video
A visiting student of mine has asked me for a recommendation of instructional videos a while ago. She was specifically interested in close embrace milonguero style. I did not watch or use any instructional videos, but Barbara Garvey did. Here is what she recommends:
Some time back I asked list members to recommend good videos for beginning tango. I was actually referring to salon-style tango, and I mentioned that we had seen practically all of those published, but not Christy Cote and George Garcia's. Since then (although we still haven't seen their Beginning-Intermediate AT Volume I tape) we have seen and used their videos I and II for Close Embrace, and they are terrific. Very well-organized, detailed and clear. Al and I recommend them highly. We have seen many other Close Embrace videos but Christy and George's are, in our opinion, by far the best for beginners because they are so easy to use and follow. Additionally we find Daniel Lapadula's, Gavito's and Tete's tapes very valuable for their individual interpretations, for those who are already fluent in this style.
Jun. 1, 2005 - How do I tell if a social dancer is good.
By looking at the dancers:
Follower
- Embrace - left hand on leader’s left shoulder or on his spine opposite to his solar plex (I call the later one "desperation" - it looks dramatic but feels quite nice and in fact improves connection somewhat). Embrace predicts connection level to some extent.
- Graceful ankles. Good dancers in BsAs have them and good dancers who visited the city for longer than two weeks tend to acquire those. Those followers who have them went beyond following the steps.
- Feet are always on the ground or close to the ground. I do not have to worry about hitting furniture, other dancers or myself by flung out foot/leg – as a result I have predictable, well defined dance space to dance in.
Leader.
- Quiet shoulders, gliding feet (quiet shoulders of course result from good balancing either in buttocks or by using entire leg, I saw both in Buenos Aires). Caveat: Nuevo dancers can also display these qualities. Since I am not a fan of Nuevo style I also look at embrace, connection at chest level. Also see below on rhythm. Nuevo style is not overly rhythmic.
- Dancers in Buenos Aires refine their dancing to the rhythm, the best of them are able to dance effortlessly to one rhythm while leading follower to a slower or quicker rhythm. For instance leader dances to a rhythm of bandoneon while leading the follower to step to a slower playing violin or to a singer. Or leader dancing to pizzicato of violin while the follower dances to the main rhythm of bandoneon.
By dancing with the followers:
All good followers in Buenos Aires have different personal styles. Some are very grounded as if they step one foot under the floor surface, others very dynamic, yet others calm, smooth and steady. What common is universally good uninterrupted connection at the ribcage and exceptional responsiveness especially during turns, which tend to be rather quick. The later of course is result of very often rotational nature of the dance at BsAs milongas.
I have just returned from almost three months of nightly dancing at BsAs milongas. Naturally I was eager to see if and how different it would be to dance back in the USA. Denver festival provided just the venue. My first impressions were somewhat disappointing. Moreover I think I was disappointing leader to some of the old friends too.
Followers in BsAs tend to have more rigid bodies (this of course leads to their higher responsiveness). I think this could be because they have to do so many grapevines in any direction when they dance. I got used to this good responsiveness and so tried to lead my turns in Denver with the same gusto I used to in BsAs. It didn’t work quite well with some of the followers. I bet they felt my lead as excessively rough. In turn I felt as if I had to drag them through the turns. What to do? I got accustomed and like the BsAs style. There were five or six exceptions (these included all followers who stayed in BsAs for extended period of time). I guess I’ll have to become more selective? Or send batches of people for extended practice in BsAs? Or move to BsAs like some of tango expatriates? In fact the later two could be valid options – I am seriously considering joining tango tourism business in BsAs.
Dec. 18, 2003 - Two count basic step in tango
Philip Seyer wrote:
"From what I'm hearing there are many ways to count the Argentine tango basic. Many refer to an 8 count basic. Daniel Trenner likes a 10 count basic..."
When a beginner asks me to show tango basic I simply walk forward to the beat. The only _essential_ variation is shifting weight in place (to the beat). It's up to the leader when, if and which nonessential variations add to the 2 count basic walk.
This is how I approach teaching tango and that's why I consider tango to be both one of the simplest and one of the most challenging dances to learn.
The 2 count basic fits any tango music. Anything beyond 2 count is not basic enough and shouldn't be called that way, I think.
Jan. 7, 2005 - Pattern approach to teaching tango - language metaphor
From a post by Bruce Stephens:
One teacher who influenced me strongly likened tango to a language, and suggested that learning patterns is something like learning and reciting poetry (or perhaps memorising phrases from a phrase book). Both of those can be valuable, but there are probably more effective ways to learn a language.
Jan. 6, 2005 - Teaching (and dancing as a result) patterns
Among the list of articles Susana Domingues posted to the Tango-L there is one passionately defending the eight-count basic step as a teaching tool:
Appearing on the Tango horizon is a philosophical debate over the teaching of the 8 count basic and the seemingly opposing view that a student must be shown only the walk as a beginning. Advocates of this idea also seem to resist the naming of patterns. They wish not to limit students to only a few set patterns and instead wish to help student leaders to arrive at patterns themselves...
Correction: student leaders should not arrive at patterns themselves. It's patterned thinking idea. Instead they should avoid patterns like a plague, creating new dance, which interprets the music on a spot. Starting with simple walking and adding walk variations one at a time.
Tom and Andy have already pointed out that the difficult issue of dance musicality conveniently brushed off in another article at the same website: (I am currently of the opinion that it is impossible to teach anyone to interpret music... A teacher of Tango attempts to teach a synopsis of a history of patterns which define "Tango"...) is not difficult at all and results from the pattern teaching approach of the instructor.
Here is another interesting article on pattern teaching: Intelligent Dancing by Richard Powers in Stanford.
This is authority-based ballroom dance. The standardized syllabus, the studio and the trainer are all precisely specified authorities, carefully controlling every detail, every shape and nuance of one's dancing. Here are the judges who will determine if you are doing it correctly. Here is the Silver Level award to certify that you satisfied the authorities. So right from the beginning they give you a blueprint of your dancing, and your job is to automatically follow that plan, that map.
That's what the word authority means. It literally means they are the author of your dancing. Not you.
That's okay. Many people need that level of authority in their lives, or they simply want someone to tell them exactly what to do, so I'm certainly not saying that this approach to ballroom dance is wrong. This is exactly right for many people. And to give authority-based ballroom studios further credit where it's due, self-esteem may be boosted when these criteria are successfully mastered.
But you can also gain positive self-esteem from self-authored dancing. Or better yet, co-authored dancing, where both dancers collaborate on creating the dance.
There is a fundamental difference between these two approaches. If the stimulus-response relationship of a situation is automatic, as it is in authority-based ballroom dance, we can't, by definition, consider the response to be as intelligent as self-authored spontaneous freestyle dancing.
Leonardo Da Vinci wrote, "Anyone who relies upon authority uses not his understanding, but rather his memory."
As I see it, this is a choice between art and craft. Art involves creativity, spontaneity and self expression. Craft is skillfully creating something which might be aesthetically pleasing, even beautiful, but without the emphasis on personal creativity and self expression.
Picasso and Degas created art. Painting by numbers is a craft. So I think of freestyle partnering is the art of dancing, while following a syllabus or trainer is the craft of dancing. Nothing is wrong with crafts — they can be very beautiful. You might do a good job of coloring within the lines and the result might be pretty, but someone else is the author.
Ballet is another authority-based dance form, as it should be (you don't see much freestyle improv ballet!). Ballet is an art for the choreographer but it's a craft for the dancers. George Balanchine said, "Dancers are my instruments, like a piano the choreographer plays." And the dancers are happy to accept that. It's the same in some ballroom studios, where the syllabus creators, often long-dead, were the artists and the dancers are the artisans.
It's your choice. Both options are valid and each has millions of devotees. Choose the one which suits your personality the best.
All I can add is that if you choose Argentine tango, you have chosen the art form where there is very little room for "eight-count basic step" pattern.
Dec. 16, 2004 - Musicality, step sets and step patterns
Steve (de Tejas) about using the same steps while dancing to different music:
I mean leaders who ignore the rhythmic signatures of their movement and force the same set of steps or step patterns, some which might be regarded as advanced, onto whatever music is playing, whether it be Donato's A Media Luz, D'Arienzo's El Flete, Tanturi's Cuatro Compases, Di Sarli's Bahia Blanca, Calo's Tristezas de le Calle Corrientes, Pugliese's La Bordona or Color Tango's Zum.
What do you mean? For instance I would do back ochos, rock step, cross and ocho cortado to all of the songs you give as examples. I would change the amplitude of these steps and relative frequency to reflect the music but otherwise they would be recognized as the same steps.
Moreover all of us have individual subsets of the steps, which we favor and most probably will use throughout music played at a milonga (different subset for milonga, the music). The subsets change over the years but will likely be the same at any particular milonga.
Do you mean sequence of steps when you write about set of steps? If so then explanation is simple: a lot of people take classes (workshops) where sequences of steps are taught and dance what they have been taught. Teaching patterns of the steps is very common approach to tango instruction. For me a breakthrough in my understanding of the dance occurred after four months of sequence based instruction when I took a workshop with Brigitta Winkler, an instructor who does not teach patterns. Another instructor who does not teach patterns (at least at workshops I have taken) is Hsueh-tze Lee.
It looks like Steve meant that people do not adjust the amplitude and rhythm of any given step to the music. Here are couple examples he gave in his reply:
I saw one leader use the same volcada with every partner to every orchestra. The way he executed the volcada fit well with slow, dramatic music, but it didn't reflect the staccato rhythms of D'Arienzo. I wouldn't say that he was off the rhythm, but that the movements did not well express the rhythmic elements of the music. I saw another leader use the same staccato turn with an ocho cortado that he used with all music, even as the orchestra was taking a dramatic pause. Again, he wasn't off the rhythm, but it was like watching a snare drum solo in the middle of .
Of course, we can say that the teaching of tango as step patterns contributes to the problem, but I was not writing about beginners or even intermediate dancers. Rather I was writing about people who in many ways might be identified as advanced dancers. (One individual I saw was a regional teacher who was dancing the same showy moves with every partner to every piece of music.) I think a lack of feeling for tango music is the problem.
Jun. 17, 2005 - Improvization in tango and jazz
Steve drew analogy between learning tango and jazz:
There are three principal methods for teaching Argentine tango: step patterns, small elements, structural systems
In learning to play jazz music, there are analagous pedagogical concepts:
step patterns [open frame - OK] = memorized pieces of music
small elements [milonguero style - OK] = short phrases
structural systems [nuevo style - OK] = scales and chord progressionsNo one learning to play jazz would even expect to develop sufficient skill in playing jazz by learning only to play memorized pieces of music, short phrases or scales and chord progressions. They learn all three. In tango, however, most dancers develop most of their knowledge through only one of the three principal teaching approaches.
What is the consequence? To continue with the over-generalization, the poorly educated salon style dancers try to improvise by using the various patterns they have learned and find trouble with navigation and rhythm. The poorly educated milonguero-style dancers have good navigational skills and are free to express the rhythm, but the dancing lacks any sense of composition or style. It's just noodling. The poorly educated nuevo dancers are busy pursuing the movement variations in their system whether it fits the available space or rhythm of the music. None of these dancers really has the skill for expression--self, musical or any other kind.
Wrong analogy. While pattern dancing is not musical indeed the last two styles do have the skills for self-expression to their specific varieties of music.
Dance improvisation with paterns does not fit melody very well (you needs to know _all_ tangos and all your patterns very well to be able to attempt somethimng like this, not on social floor of course).
Mlonguero "noodling" is well structured (composed, styled) by melody and therefore is not random really (it is true that milongueros do not ignore rhythm, yet it is an urban legend that milongueros ignore melody - in fact the workshop I am going to teach in Glenwood Springs next month will be dedicated entirely to giving dancers the tools for expressing rhythm _and_ melody).
Nuevo dancers can be rhythmic when they dance to "nuevo" music (with few syncopations).
Nov. 4, 2004 - Balance and connection
A word of advise I should not forget to give to beginners: "Just like in "real" life you have to be on your own balance - the more grounded (self-reliant) you are the more you can contribute to interaction with your partner, the more meaningful is your contribution. Hence stand on your entire foot (no tip-toeing, I need to feel where your feet are) and lean forward just enough to be able to communicate. Do not cling - desperation is wearisome." Well, maybe not to complete beginners.
The very first step I teach is shifting weight from one foot to another in place (no embrace). To facilitate torso comunication I tell students to transfer about 2/3 of their weight on the balls of their feet (in addition to showing the correct posture, leaning without bowing, leaning without presenting perky butt etc.). That leaves about 1/3 of the weight for the rest of the foot. Obviously the exact numbers are bogus, but the concept is there.
I was reminded about this recently by one of my students who told me that her other instructor told her to walk on the balls of her feet. When she was doing that the image of her feet, her "presence" felt too blurry, not crisp enough.
Dec. 3, 2004 - On quality of instruction at tango festivals
One of the reasons I didn’t plan to take many classes at Austin festival was selection of instructors. It is my perception that all of them, except Alex Krebs, are more accomplished as performance than social dancers (notice the “more” not “exclusively” qualifier). As a result they focus on teaching what they know the best - the “wide and high” performance sequences/steps instead of connection and communication (my favorite topics). The question I have is this - do all 150 people who registered for the classes plan to perform on stage? If not why take lessons from performing artists as opposed to social dance instructors? There are quite a few actual teachers from the trenches, who have years of experience teaching complete beginners in their communities to dance socially both in US and abroad by now. I know because I saw some of them in Denver.
I think the main reason is ignorance of beginners perpetuated by festival organizers. I have heard the same about festival in Miami. Tom Stermitz in Denver is an exception of course.
Dec. 10, 2004 - Istruction by performance (stage) dancers
In a follow up to the "On quality of instruction at tango festivals" post Sergio Vandekier asked:
Would you say that Pugliese, Zotto, Nito, Diego, Carlos Coppelo, Naveira, Chicho, Salas teach social dancing?
Christopher L. Everett replied:
I have all of Salas's instructional DVDs, I'd say much of it wouldn't fly in crowded settings (needs at least 1 meter of clearance for safety). If Chicho and Nito teach what I've seen them do on DVD, then much of that won't work in a crowded setting without modification (I say that with much regret as I deeply respect what they bring to tango). I've had a number of bad experiences changing fronts traveling down the line of dance, I don't care to do that on crowded floors anymore.
Rai added:
Zotto is a great dancer, I doubt if he brings much as a teacher. In general most Gustavo, Fabian, Chicho "steps" are useless for social dancing, however stuff they teach greatly improves one's social dancing skills... Personally of these I like way Gustavo dances!!. I don't like Fabian, Mauricio style;). But I think they all are great teachers, may be the only 'teachers' among all those big names.
Aug. 12, 2004 - How long does it take to learn tango
There are two parts to the dance: 1. technical and 2. emotional (the "deep-throated "!Amame!"" from the excellent article in Albuquerque Tribune ).
The first part.
a) steps can be learned fairly quickly (months or as we have learned in some cases less than a month)
b) doing steps with the music (musicality is rather technical in my opinion) can be learned fairly quickly (months if you listen to the music every day)The second, emotional part is much harder to learn. It is this part where life-long learning of tango comes from. One has to be mature enough to not be afraid to be vulnerable. One has to have enough depth (usually coming from life experience) to have something to share. That's why when I taught my daughter to tango I told her that she will need to wait at least ten-fifteen more years until she can truly enjoy the dance (and even this I was able to tell her because I know that she has the potential to empathize).
If one has the second part in her/him, then learning the steps/musicality can be relatively easy. Learning to express existing emotions via steps will take a bit longer, but I think my initial estimates are about right (one year for men, six months for women).
By the way all of the above applies to close embrace only; one cannot "!Amame!" in open embrace.
Dec. 23, 2004 - So, how long do you dance?
Neil Liveakos, the Godfather of the Memphis Argentine Tango Society reports from Buenos Aires:
Sylvia, porteña, asked how long I had been dancing. I said six years. She said that she didn't believe me. She said it felt more like six months.
Goes to show that how long you dance is not as important as where and how you dance.
Aug. 6, 2004 - On conversation of movement, good women leaders and empathy
Frank G. Williams wrote:
It's so disappointing to mark steps that give the follower latitude to interpret a lovely song and then... she totally ignores the opportunity. In the 'conversation of movement' she not only misses your straight line, she doesn't know you're listening for a come-back.
Lois Donnay wrote:
I see many more women who are good leaders than men who are good followers.
[There could be many reasons for this including the one below - OK]I wrote:
"Connection" part of tango is much harder to learn. Understanding how your partner perceives the dance and complementing / enhancing his/her tango... Not everyone is able to reach this level of connection ... because not everyone is capable to empathize. It is well known that most women empathize much easier than men. Maybe that is why it takes men longer to become a good social dancer.
--------------------------------------------------------
I think we are writing about the same thing.
Aug. 27, 2004 - More on dance arithmetic
Carlos Rojas from Portland, Oregon added these words of wisdom on Tango-L:
"...a teacher, and I don't remember who, give me that greatest advice, "listen to the music, and just feel it, the numbers (music timing) will come to you and your partner"
I couldn't agree more.
Aug. 26, 2004 - The awful truth
I have to admit I am terrible at dance arithmetic - cannot count at all. I went to Hsueh-tze lesson yesterday expecting some new challenging material. Challenging it was indeed. Complete disaster is better description. She was teaching how to walk vals on 1-23, 12-3 etc. Now I have no problem whatsoever dancing on double-time beats. In fact I enjoy dancing this way. But when it comes to stepping on specific beats (1-23 for example) I simply cannot count/find them. I wonder if it is me only and there are some advanced dancers who when they dance do count. Say they think: “I am going to walk next phrase on 1-23 and the one afterwards on 12-3”. If they do count why do they do that? I simply improvise/overlay the steps to the beats on the spot as beats come in response to the melody, my partner, the floor, how well I slept last night etc. What’s the point to counting?
Needless to say milongueros in Buenos Aires do not count. However there could be some kind of higher purpose for the students, I guess. It's just that the purpose of counting eludes me and in general feels like a gimmick. When I teach the double time beats I do a small demo and then ask students to find their own beats because we all hear music differently (both among us people and between different takes).
Aug. 10, 2005 - Different style instructors in Buenos Aires
Sergio Vandekier wrote on Tango-L:
I have identified the styles in association with their teachers: Salon: with Carlos Copello, Diego and Carolina, Nito and Elba, Mingo Pugliese, Todaro, Virulazo, Lampazo, The Zoto brothers, Carlos Copes, and every body else since this is the 'root' the 'mother' from where any other form develops by selection of some of its reach choreography and by adapting its technique to some specific conditions.
"Milonguero style" Susana Miller . This style is called "salon" by its first instructor (Tete).
"Nuevo" Gustavo Naveira, Fabian Salas, Chicho Frumboli, Pablo Veron, Claudio and Marianita in Mar del Plata. The developers of this style called it "Salon" they do not like the use of "Nuevo".I think Sergio's list of milonguero style instructors is a bit short. I guess it could be because he specializes in tango Salon and therefore might be unaware of many others who teach Milonguero in Buenos Aires. Here is just a small sample of other instructors who teach Tango Milonguero in Buenos Aires: Susana Miller, La Academia de Ana Maria Schapira, Hector Falcon, Ricardo Maceiras (El Pibe Sarandi) y Elizabeth Guerrero, Roberto Graciela, Alicia Pons, Cacho Dante and Rosana Devesa, Eugenia Cuyas, Ana Gregori, Maria Plazaola - all of these people advertise themselves as instructors of Tango Milonguero. There are of course more.
May. 10, 2006 - Personality types, learning styles, and user feedback
Another long time teacher perspective. This time from Bill in Seattle, skiing instructor:
I can relate only to teaching skiing (16 years) and will only comment about teaching and learning styles. I have been learning Tango for about two plus years.
First, a good teacher knows their students, which includes their backgrounds, other interests etc. (this takes time and can't be done in one class, too much time) Second, a good teacher adapts their teaching methods to the their client base and the learning styles of that base. Three, a good teacher can teach privates to a group (size of group will definitely affect the how).
This comes over time. It took me 5 years of teaching to understand these principles. Much was by trial and error. It was not that I taught poorly IMHO during those first years, but I was not getting through to the maximum. Largely because I would have a plan for a particular class and I would stick to it. I was teaching the plan, I was not totally understanding the student and the student's needs.
The breakthrough occurred when during my first class of one year [I teach 2 hour classes, once a week for eight weeks and they are the same group], I gave 7 or 8 different explanations for the same skill set I was trying to instill in my class. I did not tell them anything other than I was going to feed them a lot of information and it was unlikely they would remember it all of it nor was it important that they remembered it all. What was important was that at the end of class I asked each what ONE point they remembered. Their answer gave me their learning style, that gave me the insight I needed to feed information to them that from which they would be able to process and progress. Over the years, I have learned there are at least three different learning styles in each class. So I adapt my lesson plan to those styles and to the individuals.
The nice thing is that some are visual learners, some are technically oriented and if you are successful with the techies, their improvement will help the visual learner's. I think others have presented the learning styles were nicely so I won't rehash them.
The major difference with Tango lessons from skiing is, you have couples with different learning styles that learn together and you have a larger group to deal with. So it is best to assume that you will have all learning styles and you should look for the couple of dominant styles in the group.Aug. 24, 2005 - Learning to teach
Marisa Holmes has asked:
So, my question is, what have people done to learn to teach, when they have moved from taking lessons to giving them? Have any of you who teach made any particular attempt to improve your ability to instruct? Have you made changes to your teaching style to improve the results? Have you taken a class with someone you thought was a very good teacher - and what did you admire abut their technique? What else can people do to improve their ability to teach?
What a great line of questions.
Well, when I started I have learned from a great local open frame instructor in Colorado, Scott McClain. Great not because of his approach to teaching - I actually have struggled for four months through some rather arcane patterns to Di Sarli before discovering a different approach and moving on, but because of his passion for the dance and great advanced open frame classes, which I have rejoined while trying to do everything in close embrace.
The big breakthrough for me was taking a workshop with Brigitta Winkler at one of Denver festivals. Suddenly learning patterns was not required, the steps were simple and simply combined or recombined, and the emphasis was on communication of lead and follow. Unusual for me at the time and a lot of fun.
I did not like to learn via patterns so when I started to think about teaching I did not have a method to pick and use to take people from complete beginners to advanced dancers. One workshop does not a system make. I had to spend about three months inventing my own system deconstructing the way I dance and developing curriculum, writing each lesson in 5 minute long digestible and progressive intervals, selecting the music etc. before the first lesson.
As a result some of the approaches and progressions are borrowed from Brigitta (in the first beginner class), some are my own yet always logical. For instance I do not employ practice frame since developing leader-follower communication via chest connection from the very beginning is very important to me. All step progressions are fairly small to let students to literally feel the difference in communication in their body. Very important to emphasize rhythm of the steps and to do all exercises with the music from the very beginning (doing demo quick-quick-slow counts and some clapping in the beginning helps too). This way musicality does not become a big issue and naturally absorbed as classes progress.
I did have to refine the posted curriculum though to slow down the progress a bit, to introduce a review lesson (people didn't come to practica), since even though I did let a bit of a slack into the lessons they still progressed a bit too quickly for some uninitiated beginners. Tine is right however, when I taught a series of workshops to students at Colorado College the progress was quicker and curriculum held in its present form. I have refined the material I teach once more after returning from Buenos Aires since my style and appreciation of the dance have changed significantly after the visits. Reading, thinking and writing to this list helped a bit too.
Jul. 14, 2005 - Another tango blog.
Came accross another tango blog. Tango Beginner by "Pablo" in New York City. Pablo must be very gifted - he has learned and can remember sixty patterns, I can hardly remember three. He also must be very stubborn since he remains a beginner after one and a half years of learning patterns. Being in Buenos Aires twice and having sat without dancing through milongas there he still persist in learning show tango at CITA, jumps for example. There is of course an easier way to learn social tango. This is how the term Milonguero style was born.
Anyway he gave this seminal quote by Gavito:
"I step on the string bass, I lead the woman on the violin; if tango was supposed to be danced on the beat, then one drum would be enough, no need for a full orchestra."
This is indeed how milongueros dance in Buenos Aires by steping to one beat while leading followers to another. This is exactly what I was teaching at Glenwood Springs "Tango the dance of bumblebee" workshop.
Jun. 15, 2004 - On teaching on dance floor
Pia wrote about abundance of anxious women at milongas:
"Yes, Ed! Milongas often have an abundance of women who are so anxious to dance that they will say YES to anyone who asks. We do have the power to improve the overall community by saying NO to leaders who "teach" on the floor..."
As one of my lady friends pointed out: "If leader teaches me at milonga he makes me look bad, as if I do not know what I am doing, hence my chances to dance with good leaders decrease". Obviously she thinks long term. Good habbit in general.
Jan. 29, 2004 - Learning steps in open embrace first is not necessary
Lois wrote:
"Don't many people learn a step in open first, then as they get better at it move it to close?"This statement is not true according to my personal experience. There is significant overlap in the steps between open and close embrace steps, therefore it is possible to take open embrace class and do steps in close embrace. _Some_ of the more interesting steps, which I have learned in open embrace class, I have learned by doing them in close embrace from the very start simply because the lead in close embrace is natural and intuitive to me. I grok it. I would struggle to try to learn them as an open embrace steps first.
Of course other, even more exciting steps (small balance related play, lateral shuffle step) are either impossible or would be too strenuous to do in open embrace.
___________________________________
Jan. 30, 2004 Sequel
I have re-read my email and realized to my horror I wasn't lucid enough.
My point is that I do not use open, practice frame to figure out new steps, because the lead is obvious to me in close embrace and so I am comfortable with doing it in close embrace right away. I would be much less comfortable trying to figure it out in open embrace or in open embrace "practice" frame because the dynamic of the lead and follow is quite different in open embrace compare to close and not as intuitive to me. All of the above applies only to those steps which can be done in both open and close embrace.
Finally I understand that I might be an exception from the rule - she did write many, not all people.
Dec. 24, 2003 - Unled back ochos - where do they come from?
Astrid asked a while ago:
"By the way, I have a question: I was forced to act as a leader in a small practica I was invited to in Berlin, and was taught to lead for a couple of hours. All went well, except for the ochos: the same thing happened again like last time I tried it in Tokyo- as soon as I give the woman a little push, she starts off ochoing on autopilot, one ocho after another, like a clockwork kicking in, even though she had waited for my lead on all other steps. Why do women do that?"
No answer was given at the time so here is what I think:
Beginner followers do that because they are taught the mechanics of back ochos without their leaders. Occasioanlly with the wall as a partner. They often practice static back ochos without partner. Therefore they forget (or do not learn from the very beginning) that they need to wait for the lead.
Once I show the mechanics of the step in my class I have to remind the followeres that back ochos are led like any other step. And then... remind it couple times more.
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